I can still remember the early hours of the 24th June last year when the returning officer for my area called myself and the remainer designated person over. He showed us the written result and the feeling of relief and euphoria that we had voted to leave by the same eventual percentage that the nation had, swept over me.
But in the last ten months since that day many things have happened. A new Prime Minister gave us all the belief, although very brief, that she was the strong woman in charge and that `Brexit means Brexit’. Safe to say nothing has happened, court cases in the high court, challenges and debates in the House of Commons, allegations of backsliding and now to cloud and dilute the issue even more, we have a General Election in which we have to submerge ourselves.
Alongside this lack of anything concrete happening on Brexit we saw the virtual destruction of the political party that vociferously argued for and brought about the referendum and the momentous decision that this nation would in fact divorce itself from the EU.
Ukip have put themselves completely through the ringer; changes in leader, arguments and fisty cuffs in the EU parliament and our one MP leaving has not in any way endeared ourselves to the electorate. The abysmal debacle that was the Stoke Central by-election further underlined just how low we have got.
The science of elections, the electorate and how people vote is a subject that this party, it seems, could not even get a CSE in, let alone an A*. But we trundle on unabashed and with a confidence that can only come from a true British patriotic collective of people jutting their bottom jaw`s out and demonstrating very loudly what that `stiff upper lip` is.
National and local issues now to the fore, unless you are a Lib Dem of course. Theresa May has without a doubt caught us all out. She has played a blinder and blindsided the political parties, including for sure, her own. We were, at the start of a re-build. Things we were told were beginning to happen and much needed direction, changes and leadership were on their way. Shelved now, we have to make the best of what we have. However, what is emerging are the battle lines of confusion.
Labour are in total complete melt down. They have a leader who does not believe in the country and its people. The main players, the shadow Home Secretary, Foreign Secretary, Education and Chancellor of the Exchequer have handed to us on a plate so much ammunition with which we can legitimately hit them with, and this is without talking about their policies. Anti -Semitism, Racism, praising the IRA, refusal to sing the National Anthem, open door immigration, borrowing £500 Billion… goodness it is a feast.
The Tories are over confident, almost arrogant. They are backsliding on immigration and control of our borders, they are also dipping their toes in very dangerous waters; the triple lock on pensions, the five locks on tax, the cutting, not to the bone but to the marrow now, of front line services. They are all it would appear to be up for debate as they consider getting rid of them. £15 billion on so-called overseas aid confirmed as a policy. A decision, it would seem that was made on the hoof by Mrs May. Again a veritable feast for us to gorge on.
The Lib Dems are, safe to say, a single issue party; have they actually mentioned the NHS, Education etc? Tim Farron is almost demonic in his pursuit of a second referendum, his language is becoming more hysterical and singular in its message. I have yet to know who their spokespeople on national and other issues are. Mr Farron is their spokesperson and he has only one thing to say.
Tim Farron last May, when had rather different views on the idea of a second referendum.
So where are we? Well that is the million dollar question. Half way through a campaign for local councils on the 4th May we have been caught, well and truly with our pants down. I was arguing for and very disappointed with the lack of support, assistance and leadership with regards to these elections, so the spectre of a General Election can hardly be a good thing at this present time.
That being said, the tide of opinion can be swung, it appears to me that there is a need within this country for something that people can latch onto, get behind and support. Something that they can flock to in thousands. Working class people in this country desperately need a champion, they need an edge, a cause and a belief in a party that stems from and is grown from them. We have to be that party. We have to speak their language, we have to engage, talk dirty and use the industrial language that they understand. We have to have common sense policies. It is essential.
Our edge is to shun the mainstream media who have already, before we have even got going dismissed us, written us off. We need to show strength and unity and use social media, town hall meetings, and street meetings and get the message out that way. The media could then be our greatest friend and asset if we adopt the attitude that is Trumpesk. Ignore them, call them out and they will want to, and be desperate for our business.
To the Faragistas, I have made the point before that much as I admire Nigel and feel that he should certainly get a knighthood for his many achievements, he had reached his zenith as we won the 2014 EU elections.
I truly believe that in the last six months up to Freedom Day, he lost us more Brexit votes than he gained.
Secondly, I got very fed up of the fact that the dislike of Nigel amongst those voters who really should have been voting Ukip was tangible and very real. Many chose/choose to ignore the reality.
We definitely needed a new leader but I am not sure that there was/is anyone I can spot in the party who has what it takes – and running back pleading with Nigel to return would be a retrograde step which, IMHO, would drop our vote share even lower. There are some who see him as a messiah – that is an extremely long shot.
Our problems are very close to those of Labour. We are breaking up into petty, intolerant factions.
Where has all the bile, venom, bitterness and unmitigated nastiness come from in the last 18 months? (Please don’t attempt an answer to what is a largely rhetorical question.)
This excellent article about how the chickens will be coming home to roost in France and what a sham Macron is. Do read please and think big picture! This is a Tory site supporting Marine.
http://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/kathy-gyngell-le-pen-can-rescue-france-agony/
I have to disagree. The UKIP vote is going to be dramatically lower in this election and for good reason. UKIP fought for 20+ years to get the Brexit vote and at this very specific general election most UKIP supporters are going to vote for “Team Brexit” in whatever way they think best. Nothing said by Nuttall, or even Farage, will change that. UKIP needs to say this loud and clear.
There will be other opportunities to vote UKIP, but on this very occasion we should only contest seats where UKIP is the best positioned Pro-Brexit candidate.
I’m not being defeatist. I think UKIP can recover and thrive in the next few years but we need to manage expectations for this election.
We need to say publicly that this isn’t our election to fight, it’s about Team Brexit and we’re going to support it whatever way we can.
That is defeatist SK, by default if not intention.
The Tories don’t do team – they mean to destroy us. We have to stand in as many seats as possible to qualify for broadcasts, and get as many votes across the country as we can to remain a potent force.
We’ll be targeting a very small number of seats, and should only not stand in a few exceptional cases where current incumbents have been outstanding.
So I hope you’ll be voting for your UKIP candidate – otherwise what credibility will you have here?
Come on UKIP where are the rest of our policies? some more radical ones if you have some. We should be releasing at least one a day sharp, swift and to the point, but it has all gone very quiet after the initial round.
I quite liked Labour’s one today to increase the poor wages that nursing staff earn, 1% on what is already a low wage for long unsocial hours is derisory. Why did.nt we come out with that one?
And what is more worrying I heard we have slipped down to 5% in the polls, time to pull some white rabbits out the hat me thinks.
UKIP needs an effective leadership in terms of intelligence, philosophy & radicalism, with a dynamic, charismatic figure fronting it, which I’m sorry to say with Nuttall it hasn’t got. Without it it’s going nowhere in the near future, & may not have a future at all.
Oh, hello Ajax. You will be surprised to know on this I actually agree with you, but surely it is too late to change leader now?
He should have gone the day that the Stoke result was delared. He made fatal errors from which he cannot recover. Even a traitor within could not have come up with a better set of issues to destroy UKIP with.
Too late now, Ajax, your vote, along with many others, put him where he is and now we all just have to live with it.
At least John Rees-Evans is doing his own,thing, organizing speech training for prospective candidates and has a plan – see his website.
Dee,
I hope JRE has a cunning plan.
DD, he is trying! Impressive organization having identified target seats, asking candidates to meet up and he will arrange public speaking training and go through policies (lol) as well as asking UKIP activists to fill in a form so that he can organize them too – organization is what he is quite good at. But it’s working with both hands tied behind his back – he understands how crucial a Party like UKIP is for Britain, he won’t abandon it even if the results are terrible, is my belief. He will just reorganize, if he gets the chance.
Dee,
Why is he being left to do it all on his own, all that you say should be a team effort, oh, of course he is not part of the team. A bit like Anne Marie Waters who is being invited to branches and giving invaluable talks on Islam whereas we do not seem to see the leadership team coming round to see us. Bill Etheridge did offer to come round not long ago, he is about the only one.
Dee, before you crow too loudly I seem to recall that you supported every1 but Nuttall’s candidacy, from Woolfe, to James, to Kassim, etc., all of whom fell apart under the slightest pressure, & as for Rees-Evans, if you want to back a strange character who wanders around Wales in the middle of the night making bizarre self-publicity videos showing himself clambering around traffic islands, with children following him who look like cast members from the ‘Village of the Damned’, I doubt that’s going to work out too well either.
As I recall your original doubts about Nuttall were based on the fact that he wasn’t anti-Mohammedan enough for you, & hence why you were cheering his hopeless antics yesterday, so why you’ve now switched around on this in the space of a few hours is a mystery, you should be happy – you’ve got what you wanted in this regard.
Ajax, I supported Diane James, it may have been a mistake, but we will never know, and then Raheem, whose Policy proposals were brilliant and if adopted would have been fine tuned and out there by now. At least we have adopted 3 of them now. He was shafted by an “unknown source within UKIP” if you recall. The unknown source has now left UKIP, with the job done. Last I supported John R-E, at the time a bit of a rough diamond, but someone who has now, reading his website, thrown himself into organizing candidate tuition and activists in target seats – on his own initiative as usual. Imagine if he was ….
As for Nuttall, Ajax, I told you again and again that as Deputy he left the field at the most crucial time in not only UKIP, but Britain’s recent history – and anyone who could let down his party and the members in that way, never mind failing to understand what a dreadful thing he had done to his party and his country was both gutless and thick.
Had UKIP stayed strong, we wouldn’t have had any of this trouble, not in UKIP or the country. Remainers were given free rein, for weeks and weeks non stop, to organize resistance, and I cannot ever forgive him for it. Never ever.
Ajax,
For the very first time your first paragraph did make laugh out loud, but Dee’s reply did not because unfortunately what she says about Paul Nuttall are proving to be true, but we have to be positive else we will not win anything.
Yup the media is writing off UKIP and Marine. In the case of Marine whether she wins or not is eclipsed by the fact that the FN is big enough to get parliamentary seats in lots and the things she’s warning about are getting worse. She’s playing a long game. UKIP just can’t make up it’s mind whether it too is doing so or pursuing the false dawn of seeking the ‘middle ground’ where it has not a prayer. Arron Banks is proving a disappointment I fear. I thought he was a bit robust.
Massive disappointment Michael, and shock and disillusion with him on Twitter. The Patriotic Alliance doesn’t hold out much allure for many, now – he hasn’t answered why he takes this stance.
Sorry, ‘ Mike ‘ (a tad overwrought!)
Don’t suffer Dee. It’s not your fault. UKIP has been a total mess since Farage left. No wonder electors are not keen.
If May gets a huge majority and funks Brexit cuts pensions and more scandal about foreign aid plus hubris etc watch the worm turn and the appetite for something else.
At worst the principle of leaving the EU will be established. A huge huge step. Banks we’ll have to see but it’s very disappointing. Remember that the core problems of Britain are getting worse. That’s the ones the MSM don’t talk about. The debt, the deficit, the growth of separate societies here and so on. All this will catch up before long.
Mike,
It is going to be awful when the chickens come home to roost.
Yes DD. Someone said in a discussion list that a businessman said to him I can’t vote for Marine because of the economy. Reply – once the Muslims reach 20% of the population in France you won’t have an economy.
Mike,
Yes, I am very disappointed with Arron there, he backed down so easily and is not looking elsewhere it would seem, do you think he has been got at by higher powers, perhaps he is a Mason.
OMG DD, surely not! But….you could be right.
Dee,
Stranger things happen at sea, and it would not surprise me at all, I think he should come clean.
Being very new to this politics thing last night I attended my very first Branch AGM (Basildon & East Thurrock). I can report that I was more than just pleasantly surprised, I was delighted. I saw a team that was dedicated, professional, bright and competent. People that saw an opportunity not a problem. None of the negativity, none of the ‘oh woe is UKIP and where too now’ sentiment. This part of UKIP at least is on it, up and running, organising. The main sentiment was ‘so little time, so much to do’. With regards to playing dirty, from discussion it was quite clear that the Tories, or as I like to call them, the fake conservatives, are having rings run around them in this area. (I’m here referring to day-to-day council business. As to booting them out of office, that’s an entirely different matter, but from what I saw, not out of the question.) On the next table one of the councillors was multitasking, thundering away on his lap top working like a man possessed throughout. Clearly, he was only there to say a few words to us foot-soldiers and speak to colleagues when required.
In one address we were told that we need to be talking about our national debt. (I’m repeating it here because I think it’s important.)
It may have been cold outside but there was such warmth in that room!
Welcome to the Few, Michael.
Of course the national debt needs to come down – but not the way of that party ‘so competent on the economy’ – after years of austerity now the debt has only gone up.
We need to start doing things differently – by investing in infrastrucure, training and productivity – with some of the funding having to come from borrowing (at rock bottom interest rates).
How? – see my articles of January.
Yep, Q agree with you there.
Thanks, Michael – a wonderfully heartening picture painted! In a way makes it worse, so much energy at grassroots, not mirrored above.
Sadly any such efforts are wasted by Nuttall & Cronies.
TRUMPSPEAK FOR STARTERS
TORIES ARE MANOEVERING TO CUT PENSIONS IN REAL TERMS
LABOUR -A PARTY THAT SUPPORTS RELIGION – SO LONG AS IT IS ISLAMIC
THE LIBDEMS 650 DIFFERENT POLICIES FOR 650 SEATS
COMRADE CORBYN – PROUD FRIEND OF THE IRA BOMBERS
WANT AN “ASYLUM SEEKER” AS NEIGHBOUR? THEN VOTE LABOUR
THE TORIES – THE PARTY OF BIG BUSINESS FIRST AND LAST
HOME SECRETARY MAY – ALLOWED IN OVER ONE MILLION NON EU MIGRANTS
SCHOOLS FULL TO BURSTING? NHS WAITING LISTS OF 9 MONTHS? BLAME THE TORIES
TORIES – THE PEOPLE WHO DON’T CARE ABOUT ORDINARY PEOPLE.
WHITE NATIVE AND STRUGGLING WORKER? LIBLABCON SAY “Get to the back of the line”
Sorry CK doubt if it’s going to happen. I think we are going to have to rethink, regroup and start again, post election, because no matter how hard we all try in different ways, a silent and ineffectual leadership will sink us, even though I was delighted with the Integration Policy, without following it up with other useful Policies hard on its heels, any gain is rapidly undone. We need to show what we’re FOR, as well as what we’re against.
Excellent Srephen.
But if we’re serious about appealing to the patrotic working class (and yes, we do have to with all might and main) we should be offering them some policies they will support – fairer taxation, a degree of state initiative, a whiff of protectionism, an eye-catching morsel of nationalisation, and less abour grammars.
It’s our only chance – yet the ex-Tories among us won’t give an inch and would rather see us destroyed. All very regrettable and silly , yet we must fight on despite them.
Any evidence the working class support any of those things, Quercus? Because General Elections these past 30 years tell us that they do not. The state of today’s Labour Party tells us that they do not. It’s only patronising, leftist ideology that tells us the working class want state handouts, bash-the-rich taxes and comprehensives. Take the trouble to ask them, and they will tell you that they would like lower taxes, less state interference in their lives and to be able to send their kids to the best possible school, regardless of ability to pay.
This is certainly true of the “floating” Labour vote, those working class that voted Blair in the 90s but voted Thatcher in the 80s are are now politically homeless (won’t vote Corbyn, reluctant to vote Tory). And these are the people UKIP must appeal to, not the dyed in the wool Labour-till-I-die hardcore that you seem to be chasing with Corbyn-lite policies.
If you’re quick, you can probably get a place in Corbyn’s shadow cabinet before he gets defenestrated on June 8th.
Who’s advocating Socialism here, Gary? You’re insisting on lumping pragmatic but principled policies with Socialism as ideology.
Are you suggesting that Blair was on the right of Major when he won the 1997 landslide GE? Assuming that it’s so, why then was Hague unable to reverse the slide in the Tories’ electoral fortunes?
And by extension why did it take the modernisation project of Cameron to restore the Tories to power? The modernisation project spoke of ‘distributing the proceeds of growth’ and ‘achieving conservative ends through progressive means’ both of which imply and entail State intervention.
I didn’t mention socialism, revealing that you did. I think you protest too much.
As you will recall, Labour moved to the right in order to get elected under Blair. They were, to various degrees, unelectable under Foot, Kinnock, Miliband and now Corbyn, all of whom are to the left of Blair. As is Quercus.
The “modernisation” of the Tories cost them a General Election win in 2010. After 13 years of New Labour, the country would have voted for proper conservative values and policies once more, had they been offered. Instead we got Blu-Labour, liked by almost nobody but in power aas they are the least worst of two terrible options. See also the attempt to “detoxify” UKIP that our current leadership has pursued that has seen support for UKIP hemorrhage.
There is no right of centre political party in UK politics. They are all variations on ever bigger government, ever bigger taxes. The British public are by nature suspicious of government and politicians, don’t like paying taxes and want to be left to do and say what they like without government interference. That is why the country voted to leave the EU, by the way. There’s a natural progression on offer for UKIP to transpose it’s anti-EU philosophy and arguments onto a similarly overbearing, incompetent and wasteful UK government. It may be too late now, but UKIP had a chance to establish itself as the only right of centre party advocating lower taxes, smaller government, common sense policies.
UKIP will die if we choose to fight on overcrowded, occupied territory with bigger, more established parties. For UKIP to be patriotic, anti-immigration, but in all other respects indistinguishable from the Lib/Lab/Con is not enough. A patriotic, anti-immigration UKIP that seizes the vacated right of British politics, claims it as our own, rails against the political establishment and their overbearing, wasteful pet projects and establishment priorities will attract millions of voters.
We need a philosophy and policies that will enable us to survive in the short run and establish ourselves as a real force in UK politics in the decade to come. Parroting the Lib/Lab/Con consensus wrapped in a Union Jack is not enough to give people a reason to vote UKIP.
I do wonder why those who favour bigger government, top-down, big-state-knows-best policies are even in UKIP. Surely the EU is the ultimate expression of their philosophy?
Because I come from it, Gary, and I speak to people of all classes and read widely on the politics of our country. I’m now standing in my fith election – what about you?
We’re totally under-rating a very large part of the Labour vote – people who believe in their country and hard work but will not vote for the party of wealth and big business.
We couldn’t have won Brexit without them, yet you and so many others won’t give them an inch.
Your reference to me in Corbyn’s cabinet is a measure of the emptiness of your argument.
Oh! that dreary old phrase;
“for the first time in my life”………………..
………..well, I do believe I am agreeing with Quercus.
But I don`t just suggest a “degree” or a “whiff” or even a “stye in the eye”
NO pinch the whole bleeding lot of the others policies!!!!!!!
After all Magpie May has pinched half UKIP`s previous policies and lately Corbyn has pinched most of the rest of them, not particularly for the good of the country but just to knock spots off each other in an attempt to marginalise us who are the true architects of Brexit; each pretending to be Brexiteers (having voted that way in the Commons), but we know one making an all out effort to scupper the whole business (an enemy of the people 17.4million)
Following Corbyn`s wish list at PMs` Questions, I`m sure UKIP could promise to
Attend to the Housing problem,
Pay the Doctors more
Pay the nurses more
Pay Care in the Community workers and funds generally more.
Pay Nurses tuition fees and bursaries.
Employ and train more home grown Nurses,
Employ and train more health and care workers
Grow more home grown doctors
Cut A & E waiting times (I assume he meant by immediately employing more non-existent doctors and building more hospitals with A & E departments and more doctor`s surgeries desperately needed to cope with the “FULL UPNESS” following immigration swamping)
Oh! where is he/we/she going to get all this extra money from?
Well wasn`t there said to be a “bring back” of £350 billion per second following the end of Brexit.
But what if Brexit is delayed or the return reduced?
Well do what we always do “borrow it” just add it to the meaningless debt and deficit, the money will roll in some day and it is always good to “borrow to invest”
Surely UKIP, that`s a bit underhand! well if you can`t stand the heat……..don`t go into their kitchen!
So come on UKIP swipe the lot, they can hardly complain and even if you do win a majority the law says it`s legal to do an 180degree U -turn on manifesto promises.
It`ll be fun occupying the most Central ground in politics!
Do you want to have any chance of stopping mass immigration, Roger – or not?
Q.
Hate to say this but I don’t think we can stop it now, the odds seem stacked against us.
DD,
It not only has to be stopped; our country can only be saved from the Muslim invader by repatriation. That will be a difficult policy to sell until the invader becomes even more entrenched and people then realise, hopefully, where we are heading.
Whatever my suggestions brought about, something for those who had always voted Labour but wanted Brexit could not EVAH! bring themselves to vote Tory (and I had that comment quite often); those Labour voters who came to us in the last GE and helped us to get 2nd places, plus those Tories who were marginalised in heavy Labour areas, plus any other “odds and ends” (including Lib Dems who voted to LEAVE – I know one – ex service man plus many of his association)
We aren`t going to influence mass immigration! – we have no matches to light the fires under Magpie`s toes – Just be grateful she brought us back from the grave.(of our own excavation – I always said if anybody remembers we should have been cross party with the GO campaign folk – the day after June23rd)
Stephen, I agree with all you say. We have dropped our first Integration bombshell but that absolutely MUST be followed up sharpish if not sooner by other Policies. It’s no good assuming, either, that we don’t have to speak out on what we want for Brexit – maybe they will today, but we need another press conference giving our view of how Brexit will happen – 6 things you need to ask your MP if you propose to vote Tory – that sort of thing. Then we need domestic policies loud and clear. Maybe I’ve missed them, but all I have seen so far is Carl UKIP on social media saying UKIP will ….This that and the other. I am now behind Mr Nuttall as he has delivered Ban Sharia etc. but he needs to get some Red Bull down him and be out there – you’d think we had months – we don’t.
The other thing woefully lacking is a decent on line presence – Robin Hood UKIP does well but it’s not, imo, enough.
If we lose badly in the GE, really badly, it won’t be because of the Integration Policy, which has a great deal of approval (indeed, Arron Banks being against it has engendered at least 80% comments of ‘why’ – and only a few of support) and Raheem has got behind it too – it will be because, as far as I can see, we are being very lack luster on the one thing Nuttall can talk about – a proper, full-on Brexit, as well as other policies.
Dee, I made my comment elsewhere about the quality and lack of impact of that Press Conference captured by Robin Hood and so support your comments.
It seems to me we have no “media savvy” publicity department at all.
For all the talk a couple of years ago of UKIP becoming “professional” we just aren`t in fact, I think you will know a word from my Rugby days in Wales “Hwll” (spelling???), whatever the spelling is it meant “Spirit” – we just don`t appear to have it, particularly not at the top.
To me Nuttall always comes across as “bluster”, I know a certain Irishman said you have to get the `retaliation` in first, but I`m afraid he is not a communicator nor does he appear to have a team of professionals or thinkers around him who can conceive a comprehensive “narrative” nor coach him in his selection of points and arguments, nor in their delivery.
Essentially we are involved in a selling operation, we have got to know thoroughly what our product is our USPs and rehearsed so that we at least speak nationally from the same hymn sheet.
“Headless Chickens” comes to mind, coupled with “whelk Stalls”
Absolutely, Roger, but when Nuttall was elected they closed rank at the top – may have been Carswell influence – and didn’t bring in or seek out any of the huge pool of talent within UKIP members. I fear we will do very badly, because we aren’t even out there standing up for a UKIP Brexit.
After all this is over we need to ……..we all know what must follow.
…………you were going to say Dee?
“Night of thelongknives”……………only trouble our best Knight-to-be never became a Knight so who is to wield said knives?
Members will have to, Roger, led by John R-E?
Roger,
Muslims seem to be very adept with knives these days.
Dee,
All we have is someone (i.e. only one- Evans was it?)tasked with producing a new manifesto and already having taken too long over a task which a group of like-minded people, such as those who comment on here, could have produced a draft of in a day.
Urgency is clearly not a priority of the leadership.