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Letter on the Leadership Election

It is an extraordinary step for UKIP Daily and for me as Editor-in-Chief to take a post down, but I am forced to do so.

Ms Watts had sent me her letter at the beginning of the week, and we were in correspondence because in my opinion it needed a re-write for various reasons. She send me the re-written copy which I published below. She did write that I was free to edit as I saw fit. 

What she did not do was informing me that she had also submitted her letter to ‘kipper central’. It’s her right to do so, but all other correspondents inform me that they have submitted their letters elsewhere as well, and inform me if they had been published. She did not do that, nor did she inform me that her letter had been published on ‘kippercentral’  early this morning. It is a courtesy amongst online publications to provide such links because the early publication has the copyright and usually permission is asked by the publisher if the article in question can be published elsewhere.

Since UKIP Daily was thus prevented from asking permission, and since Ms Watts did not see fit to inform me, I am forced to take this post down as a matter of editorial policy.

Ed: This letter was submitted by Pam Watts and is addressed to Henry Bolton, Nigel Farage and UKIP members:

In case you want to know, I voted for Anne Marie Waters.


Pam Watts

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32 Comments on Letter on the Leadership Election

  1. An interesting view is expressed here:

    I wait to see if such points get addressed now. Certainly some should have been addressed a long time ago. The fact that they weren’t is still worrying.

  2. Viv, When I started posting on UKPD you were kind enough to explain these things to me. I thought they were you own rules. I had no idea.

    So HOW ABOUT 10 COMMANDMENTS OF THE BLOG. Perhaps this is not wise , but, …..

  3. The fact that the members of Ukip have chosen HB rather than AMW to be their leader reminds me of an old joke.

    It is night time and a man is scratching about on the pavement underneath a street light. A passing friend asks what he is doing and the man replies that he dropped his keys and is trying to find them. The friend joins in the search but to no avail. Eventually the friend asks the man if it was definitely here where he dropped his keys.

    The man replies “No, it was over there but the light is better here”.

  4. Look guys, AMW lost and immediately jumped ship, as did R-J. Not exactly committed to the party or the democratic process are they ?
    We now have HB and since any further leadership contests will destroy us for good, we need to support him. There is no viable alternative at this stage in the game. AMW and R-J are now irrelevant. Nothing to do with UKIP.
    We need to get on with it, not keep going on about what could have been. No one, just no one agrees with every policy of their party or with everything their leader says. Most of us pick the party we are most in tune with and go with that. Just as most Tories are now doing with the fatally damaged May. They know the alternative is Corbyn in no, 10. We should grasp that failure to support “new” UKIP will seriously damage proper Brexit.

    • icini,

      Please read AMW’s posting in the Who’s Leaving, Who’s Staying thread today. It explains exactly why she did what she did and I have no wish to put words in her mouth.

  5. Viv, Kipper Central have a policy of only publishing original material, as most newspapers also have. Perhaps UKIP daily as the senior and most read journal should do the same. One reason why I don’t write for KC. I prefer the Daily audience.

    • David – I’m not blaming ‘kippercentral’, they probably hadn’t been told that this letter had already been submitted to UKIP Daily.
      I received the first draft of this letter on Oct 2nd, and had been in correspondence with Ms Watts, telling her on Oct 4th that the re-written letter would be be published this weekend.
      There was ample time for her to inform me that she’d submitted this elsewhere, as all correspondents do who send in letters for publication.
      Since her letter was published a few hours before we published, not informing us is discourteous at the very least.

      • I don’t write the same thing to different bodies but I was unaware of the ‘rules’ regarding publication. I thought the copyright remained with the author (unless paid). I’m sure there are many others unaware. Now we know.

        • “Reproduction of Content
          Articles published by UKIP Daily are the express property of the website and its authors, and must not be cross-posted or copied in full without permission. However, our regular contributors may cross post to personal websites.”

          This is not unique to UKIP Daily, this is how it’s done on other sites. Many authors/blog owners whom we approach for permission quite rightly ask that the link to their site is also published.
          Having her letter published on ‘kippercentral’ before it was published here without informing us, and without informing us that she’d submitted it elsewhere, we were in breach of these rules, albeit unwittingly, thus creating a bad basis for us to cooperate with ‘kippercentral’ and with other blogs and their authors.
          I accepted the letter in good faith because I thought it only fair to allow members to express their dissatisfaction. Had I been informed at the outset that this letter had also been submitted elsewhere, I’d not have published it as original.

  6. I repeat. It’s always good to adopt an already half won policy that has no figurehead. The tories have done it since the war.

    Everyone loves Nigel if he’ld only shut up a bit.

    AMW has already done the start up and hard work, and received the mindless opprobrium. Capitalise. She could become St Anne Marie.

    Apropos the Internment issue. My grandmother was German and interned . After a week in a hotel she was supposed to sign on each week at the local cop shop. She acquired serious suport from the other wives and men left in the village. And even the policemen. Who felt rather indignant.

  7. I went to an early lecture by AMW. It was impressive. She was obviously practised. She knows her stuff. As with all these things, it was impossible to measure her basic reactions and motivation. I did wonder and still do if these were religious, sympathetic, etc. After all we all love the Irish and they love a good scrap. I was satisfied she’ld make a good leader, but a bit too clever and intense for the comfort loving.

    Bye the bye, I didn’t vote. My assessment was that none could cope on their own. I trusted whowever won would also recognise this, and have the sense to assess everyone around him. As individuals.
    I also concluded that at some stage in this battle for supremacy, organisation and policy would shine through. The terror of the unknown. It didn,t.

    So nearly in conclusion. I shall join any or all parties I feel worth following.

    Unfortunately I gave a week for some sign that ukip would succeed in any of its aims ( if indeed there are any ). There’s still another 2 weeks for other signs to show.

    I repeat. Nigel should be given a proper peerage.

    • TG, you said: ‘I did wonder and still do if these were religious, sympathetic, etc.’ AMW was a member of the governing council of the National Secular Society for a time, and so I’d guess religious motivation can be ruled out.

  8. I think you make a valid point about why HB joined the party. Has anyone from UKIP asked him directly? David Allen stood and down backed him after meeting him on only one occasion. He certainly seems to have had none of the scrutiny of some of the other contenders. Nobody seems to know the man personally but have backed him on his CV, which as impressive as it is tells us nothing about his political beliefs. Is there is any truth in the allegations made by AJ Roberts here now being investigated by far right watch stated in the replies here
    There could well be a hole in the bucket and the party need to be prepared to answer any questions on this.

    • Interesting and unfortunate it didn’t emerge before his election. UKIP has a track record of picking unsuitable leaders; one might think that due diligence was also lacking this time.

      • There’s no online evidence to back it up…?

      • On this point of sufficient / any due diligence, the question I have never heard answered is why didn’t he run for UKIP in the 2015 GE. Is it because he only left the Libdems in 2014 and he didn’t have sufficient time under his belt? He replied to me on 2017 and said he didn’t run because he was under a government contract at the time and the deadline was so tight that there was no way to get out of it, which I tend to believe as the deadlines were nuts (we had 2 days notice to decide whether or not to stand). But 2015?

    • Actually, I met him also when he campaigned for PCC in Kent whilst we were manning a stall in Tonbridge, these little innaccuracies flourish like unsubstantiated allegations, it’s always best to check facts before publishing. The Party management represented by The returning officer, the interim leader and the party secretary conducted vetting interviews of all candidates.

      • I took the information from your article on this site so I assumed it was correct, your words
        On Sunday 20th August 2017, I rang Henry Bolton. I had met him once before when he stood as the PPC in Kent. It was a brief encounter as I recall. However, I scrutinised his website and campaign messaging, as I have done with all the other candidates and it seemed that electoral reform was also an issue that he felt strongly about. That discussion, another conversation and further scrutiny on my part led me to believe that Henry Bolton could win the leadership.

    • I used to be a director of a company managing a shared freehold. Chasing leaseholders for service charge debts was the most unpleasant side of the role. If it is true that HB is 4 years in arrears then I can only imagine what kind of individual he really is. What happens is that the rest of the leaseholders hold off taking the leaseholder in debt to court because you end spending money you’ve saved for repairs and maintenance on solicitors. It’s a complete waste of everybody’s money just because some are too tight to pay their own way. What normally happens in the end though is should the leaseholder in debt want to sell their property the directors of the management company can refuse to process any lease/share transfers unless the debt is paid first. They then tend to pay up sharpish in order that the sale of their property doesn’t fall through. Paying service charges late is common and some leaseholders occasionally are just one year in arrears but 4 is completely out of order. I suspect he might be short of money.

      Anyway if this is true and now it has come out in the open I suspect the debt will be paid quickly. Nigel might bail him out if true.

      • I guess we now know why HB wanted to make sure he got a salary to be UKIP leader!

      • I, too, ran a shared freehold company, and agree service charge arrears were aleays a pain…

        • I’m not saying it’s true and if it is true he may have had legitimate reasons to query the service charge. However from the Tweet it seems he hasn’t paid since he moved in which is very worrying. If you aren’t happy with the service charge don’t buy the flat in the first place. Also 4 years to resolve any issues is more than ample time. If it is true then it is dodgy to say the least. And if it is true it looks like Farage has jinxed it again and backed another dud.

    • These matters are extremely concerning and should be answered or rebutted without further delay. If Henry Bolton or a member of his team keeps an eye on UKIPDaily, he/they would do well to address them, and soon. They are damaging, and not only for him as an individual but, more importantly for UKIP.

  9. Apology, Pam? You must be joking.
    The situation pertaining to the Referendum will not and cannot be replicated. Our very success on that one issue almost guaranteed our ensuing irrelevance, and the events of 2017 have merely confirmed it.
    Our only ever chance was to broaden our appeal with a radical alternative vision for the country across the whole spectrum of policy, which we have signally failed to do and now, with HB, certainly won’t.
    You were right first time.

  10. Whilst I welcome Pam’s, eventual, conclusion I couldn’t disagree with her more about virtually everything else.
    It is a shallow allegation that only Ms Waters, has the courage, purposefulness, strength, determination etc. etc to deal with the elements of Islam prevalent and damaging to our society, but ironically, the opposite is true. Shouting at people alone doesn’t get results. It is a political problem and needs a political solution as well as political will. UKIP has both Ms Waters has just the latter.
    In a very lengthy election campaign Ms Waters proffered no strategy, no plan, no political insight, just regular and repetitive rhetoric. Also, what was this understanding:
    ‘that her campaign was specifically targeted against the malevolent end of Radical Islam, and that it did not include the Muslim community who embrace our culture and freedoms, respect our law, contribute to society and treat women as equals.’
    Because I don’t see how a policy of internment can make those differentiations and Ms Waters supports and would implement internment were she to ever be in a position to do that, which, fortunately she won’t. It is not for no reason that real political parties will have nothing to do with her.
    UKIP displayed their utter incompetence by allowing her to stand in a leadership election when the party had barred her from standing in a parliamentary one, as her failed candidacies for the Labour party are testament to. It was a clear breach of our rules for reasons that were unclear and the challenge was to the NEC on those grounds and not an attack or anything else against Ms Waters.
    She is a campaigner with an increasingly focused and discriminatory message. She is now doing the right thing. When no political party want’s you the next best thing is to set one up yourself. Good luck with that.

  11. A true leader would have recognised AMW for the asset she was and been right up there recruiting her after the vote was counted.
    A true leader, Bolton is not, petulantly throwing his toys out of the pram.
    And Nigel’s comments? They leave me speechless.
    I will give it a few months before I decide to jump ship or not.


    • It’s odd how political parties, Labour before us, just don’t realise what a tremendous asset she is? If you can descibe any plan she may have to achieve her objectives I would be pleased to hear it?

      • David,

        Here’s the plan: to raise the level of the debate. Throughout PC-infested Britain in the 21st Century, you are effectively barred from talking about islam. Even Lord Pearson has reported that he is unable to access information about the Koran and Sharia in the House of Lords.

        For goodness SAKE – a peer of the realm, at the top of the establishment, is banned from doing his own research??? HOW SINISTER IS THAT??????

        Anyway, Anne Marie wants to make sure islam and sharia are discussed, as widely as possible. THAT is the plan, David. Then we can all make our own minds up on the subject, can we not?

        How’s that for democracy?

        She has no chance of doing that in UKIP, she has posted as much on this site today.

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